@marou_pp | Maxime Rouquet
@tvelocity | Antonios Motakis
@Gilles_PPDE | Gilles Bordelais
@AndersPirat | Anders Kleppe
@teirdes | Amelia Andersdotter
@CristianBulumac | Cristian Bulumac
@Radeks00 | Radek P.
@Popol349 | Paul Bossu\\in the flight to brazil at the time of the boardmeeting
@LunaLoof | Martina Pöser
@Thomas1G || Thomas Gaul
@vonPecka || Mikuláš Peksa
Maxime is opening the meeting at 21:20 CET.
Chairperson: Maxime
Minutes (Secretary): everybody not talking…
* Board meeting on the th of August 2014: http://ppeu.net/wiki/doku.php?id=ppeu:board:minutes2014-08-20
→ Approved? The Board approves these minutes.
* Board meeting on the 05th of September 2014: http://ppeu.net/wiki/doku.php?id=ppeu:board:minutes2014-09-05
→ Approved ? The Board approves these minutes.
* Board meeting on the 17th of November 2014 : http://ppeu.net/wiki/doku.php?id=ppeu:board:minutes2014-11-17
→ Approved ? The Board approves these minutes.
TOP 1 Registering the party
TOP 2 Banking account
TOP 3 Activating the Council / Next Council Meeting
TOP 4 Communication Strategy
TOP 5 Procedural Rules for the Board
TOP 6 Other Stuff
TOP 7 Next Board Meeting
Approved? The Board approves the agenda.
→ Quick summary : The Board is voting if we want to register or not as an AISBL. We also need ID and a signed paper of each Board member accepting his seat.
Almost everything is ready. The following pad has been created to track the documents : https://ppeu.piratenpad.de/aisbl-registration-documents
*Decision from previous Board meeting: Gilles and Paul with the help of Anders will work on registering PPEU.
Reminder : Paul did find a notary. Paul and Gilles filled in the forms, they were waiting for the statutes translation.
@Gilles, Paul & Anders: Anything new ?
Anders: Had a meeting with JANSEN legal, Avenue Louise 375/8; Bruxelles 1050 - Avocat Agate Radziszewski. Kash was attending the meeting as translator.
The only missing formality according to Radziszewski the only formal thing to submit now are copy of national- (one side only)/EU ID papers (both sides), signature from the board member and a sentence stating that the board member accept the responsibilities following a position in the PPEU board. (If Maxime can call the lawyer and get this sentence juridical correct, Anders would really appreciate it).
Notary's office is also agreed with to proceed. The board should already have the information. Anders will scan and send details to the lawyer and the notary to the board's mailinglist.
Maxime will call the lawyer office.
* Debate about the registration as an AISBL
The Board debates whether we should register as an official AISBL. This would imply more administrative obligations to fulfill, so time and possibly some money spent in the upcoming years, while the benefits of having a registered PPEU would not likely be at our reach before a few years given the EU elections results.
Nobody discuss PPEU's existence in itself, but concerns are raised about the additional work for no immediate value of a PPEU registered as an AISBL.
Proposal of vote of the Board by e-mail, with 72 hours delay to answer. Rules of voting : each Board member can support one or more option, the option with the most support and with the majority will be the Board decision. a) We register the PPEU as an AISBL b) We do not register the PPEU as an AISBL, and will let the annual Council meeting (in Spring 2015) deal with it c) We organise a Council meeting to vote whether or not we register the PPEU as an AISBL
The Board adopts this procedure of voting on this question. Tony will email the ppeu board mailing list calling all board members to add their vote.thank you tony Final vote (by e-mail) : a) Anders, Tony, Radek, b) c) Maxime, Paul, Amelia, Gilles
Reminders :
We also need the personal details of everyone on the board : https://ppeu.piratenpad.de/Board
→ Cristian personal details are missing. → ??? will contact him. –> Cristian has stepped down
HOW-TO AISBL with work from Cristian and Paul here: http://www.titanpad.com/aisbl
Paul will help Gilles for all the administrative stuff : notaries, ministry, tribunal, ..
A pad is created to sum up the documents and follow the registration, at the following address : https://ppeu.piratenpad.de/aisbl-registration-documents
It has been discussed quickly whether it is necessary to register as an AISBL and to create a bank account right now. It appears we have various opinions in the Board and we need to discuss further about it before taking a decision.
→ Gilles is leaving at that point. We mostly skip to point 6.
→ Quick summary : Postponed until we take the decision on the registration as an AISBL.
Reminder : We have to deposit the AISBL registration papers to the Ministry, and then we can open a bank account. Radek will be in Brussels during December 1st-3rd to get that done with Paul, Gilles and Anders.
@Paul, Gilles & Radek:
1. Could we get our money back in case we will be unable to register as an aisbl at all?
Gilles has not the answer yet. He usually meets every week with Paul and they will look for the answer for next time.
It is likely that we have no registering fee to pay if we are unable to register. However it is possible that we have to pay notary costs. However, the PP-NO has proposed to support the costs of registration, so there is no financial risk for PPEU whatever happens.
2. Did you limit the amount that one person may withdraw to € 500,-?
This decision has been sugggested to the Board at the begining of the meeting of August 5th : http://ppeu.net/wiki/doku.php?id=ppeu:board:minutes2014-08-20#top_1_banking_account
Tony asks whether the limit is per withdrawal or per day/week/month. Gilles/Radek/Paul will look into it (but as far as they remember it´s a daily limit)
3. Shall we choose a 4th person next to Paul, Gilles & Radek to have access to the banking account? And if yes, whom?
The Board thinks it would be a good idea.
Maxime would volunteer, but suggests we postpone to ask Martina and Amelia's views.
4. Anything else new?
We can open the account soon. However, we will only be able to withdraw the money once we will be an AISBL.
What happens with collected funds on the account if we can't get the aisbl registered? Gilles/Paul will clear this up.
*Managing of cash in Brussels by Cristian? Postponed until we actually have/need money
*When can we start asking for membership fees? We need to recalculate them because of the European elections. (The same goes for the voting rigths in the Council.) radek will calculate projected membership fees
5. Current state and next steps
Radek has discussed with Anders. He thinks the procedure is different from what we had found before. It seems we need to register by sending papers to the Belgium Ministry before opening a bank account.
Radek will be in Brussels at the begining of December (from 1th to 3rd). We should deposit the registration papers for becoming an AISBL to the Belgian Ministry. Then therefore we will be able to open a bank account.
Thomas Gaul (guest) asks to excuse Martina who has worked for Pirate matters all day and could not join tonight. He advises to contact Koen from PPI who has done a lot of work to re-register the PPI.
→ Quick summary : we will see with Martina to set up the Council mailing-list and discuss whether we should organise an online or IRL Council meeting, where and when.
*Martina has written to all member parties and asked for names and email-adresses of their delegates.
PP-Poland and PP-GR are in the process of electing new delegates and will give Martina the information as soon as they have chosen them.
Martina will write to the missing PPs once more and there is sadly still some answers missing. But the list gets better. Martina suggests to hand the known and confirmed information already over to Jens Stomber, so that he can set up the Council with those delegates that we already know of. Martina offers to do so, as she is maintaining the list.
*Here is an incomplete and not for sure list of the Council members at the Founding meeting of PPEU: https://piratenpad.de/p/ppeubrussels (And it doesn't have email-adresses)
→ The list Martina maintains is not onlie because of the personal data involved.
*As the Board could also ask for a Council meeting we should also have this information and be able to join the ml of the Council (at least with reading access). Martina will ask Jens Stomber to add all Board members to the Council mailing list.
*We also need the list of delegates from the founding meeting to add to the minutes of that meeting. This seems to be missing and it might become a problem when we try to register the party. So Martina tries to at least get theinformation together who has been a delegate at the founding for which party, as the registry went missing.
*We will have to recalculate the voting rights for each member party in the Council, because the number of votes may have changed since the European elections in May 2014.
*What about PP-CAT and PP-Confederacion ES? Are they both still ordinary members or is only PP-ESCON an ordinary member as PP-CAT is a member party there?
* Next annual “GA-like” Council Meeting
We should start to prepare the “annual” Council Meeting, in particular if we want to do something IRL, to have time for organisation and for delegates to be able to come in good conditions. Some might want to propose amendments to the Statutes too. We need to prepare a procedure and an agenda for these proposals.
* Brussels
It is discussed whether we should organise a Council meeting in Julia's office in Brussels. It could be easier for us to organise, and to have Board members present. We will ask Julia's office about this solution.
We also need to consult the other Board members to see what they think. Another option could be an online meeting of PPEU Council to discuss some points, and that one of this subjects would be the modalities of the annual Council meeting.
We therefore need the Council to be ready to meet and take decisions, at least online.
Maxime will ask Martina for updates on the Council ML and propose to help her collect the eventual missing addresses.
Thomas Gaul (from PPI) asks the Board to collect this list and insists on the fact that each Board member is responsible for this list to be collected.
Anders volunteers to prepare this list and share a private pad with the board members.
Mikuláš Peksa tells us that PP-CZ is thinking about hosting a conference open to EU pirates around next February. It could be the occasion to meet for the PPEU Council.
This point is out of date. We would probably need to re-think most of it from scratch. Right now we have not enough active members to deal with it, but hopefully it will change.
Postponed.
→ Quick summary : only 2 points remain to discussion. It will be discussed IRL by the Board members going to Brussels in the beginning of December.
*Draft: https://eu.piratenpad.de/ppeu-board-rules-of-procedure
Martina, Anders and Maxime have worked hard on it and hope that it finds the approval of all Board members now.
Any proposals for a change?
* Adding consensus Proposal : add the following paragraph at the end of chapter § 6 Meeting minutes : The votes of each Board member for every decision are written in the minutes. However, when no Board members present disagrees on a decision, the minutes simply give the Board decision.
Shorter alternative : The votes of each Board member for every decision are written in the minutes, unless no Board members present disagree on the decision.
Other alternative : The decisions of the Board are taken by unanimity/consensus, unless Board members disagrees. In the following case, the detail of the Board member votes is written in the minutes.
→ Maxime has proposed another wording directly in the RoP pad. Opinions ?
Martina and Maxime also suggest to study again the quotas needed to take Board decisions, before adopting it. It was written believing almost all Board members would attend Board meetings, but it has not been the case lately.
The Board must choose between two options : having a low quota required, with the risks of decisions taken by a low number of Board members, or having a high quota required, with the risks of being impossible to take decisions, if too many Board members do not attend the meetings.
A meeting has been proposed dedicated to this subject, unsuccessfully. Anders suggests that the Board members who will meet in Brussels in the beginning of December should organise a small meeting to discuss about it too.
Reminder of the previous meetings :
*Martina: Could we install an e-voting system like PPI did? Does anyone know how that one works and what it is supposed to do? Galileo(SP): Agora Voting https://agoravoting.com/
We can help from spain with that one. It is prepared for general voting and has implemented Liquid Democracy inside.
Pirates without borders are meeting in Frankfurt November Its about voting online systems. http://blog.pirates-without-borders.org/2014/08/14/announcement-international-orga-weekend/
29th and 30th November 2014
Venue
FRANKFURT AM MAIN
Haus der Jugend Frankfurt
Deutschherrnufer 12
60594 Frankfurt/Main
Germany
Begin: Saturday from 11 AM CEST
End: Sonday 4 PM CEST
→ This is a political decision which we will leave to the council. For our number of members, this is not needed.
*ECI on TTIP: Shall we support it?
http://stop-ttip.org/registration/
Martina: yes (except if there is a contradiction to the manifesto or a member party objects vehemently)
Amelia has expressed by email concerns about signing this ECI or any ECI. Various reasons, one of them being ECI should be signed and presented by citizens (meaning individuals). Therefore pirates should instead sign all as individual citizens, but is is not the role of PPEU to sign it.
Julia supports the ECI, as do PPDE and the Greens/EFA group in the EP.
Maxime is reluctant to sign the ECI as PPEU, not for ideological reasons, but because it is difficult for us to know the impact of such signature in every Europe sovereign state. Therefore we should not support this ECI or any other, unless the Council gives a clear decision that PPEU should support the ECI that share our ideas.
Gilles says we should support this ECI, towards the public and the press, also to help it gain a larger audience.
It is decided to vote on this quesiton by email. Tony will send the email with the question “Does PPEU support the ECI againt TTIP/CETA?” with the two options “yes” and “no” (and “abstain”). The vote will end as soon as all Board members will have voted, or at last when this point will be dealed with during the next Board meeting.
Result of the vote by e-mail :
Amelia & Maxime voted no. Martina voted yes. The other Board members did not answer.
Mikuláš Peksa, deputee international coordinator for PP-CZ, proposes to create a web page presenting PPEU's position, and to hand it to PPEU's Board.
* It has been proposed by e-mail that PPEU Board meetings will now take place on a Monday evening around once a month.
The Board will convene again on the 2015/01/12 at 21.00 CEST on the German NRW Mumble server in room PPEU.
Maxime closes the meeting at 22:33 CET on the 2014/12/15.